What academic qualifications does Mr. Metcalfe have to authoritatively speak on subjects like the historicity of the Book of Abraham? Im not sure why I would have been hesitant to answer the question during the interview since Ive addressed it numerous timesIll have to go back and listen. In these two episodes we discuss: The aftermath of the Mark Hofmann bombings, and Brent's excommunication for his research into the Book of Mormon, and Brent's review of challenges to traditional approaches to the Book of Mormon. Cultural Context Preceding the Book of Mormon. :). I am war weary defending truths that just dont appear true anymore. fireside chat september 3, 1939 summary . The full title is: The life, conversion, preaching, travels, and sufferings of Elias Smith. And a small footnote: Many of these original founders had been part of an on-campus group, called the Open Door Club. But such intellectual issues didnt play a role in my failure of faith. Im was left kind of hot but dry after hoping to hear about his drama with the church and its leaders.any chance of allowing closure for me here? John Dehlin Faces Excommunication. Its done. Thanks so much for posting this. For the listeners who are curious, a portion of the book describes a first vision, copied below: https://play.google.com/books/reader?printsec=frontcover&output=reader&id=XH0rAAAAYAAJ&pg=GBS.PA54, The Lamb once slain appeared to my understanding, and while viewing him, I felt such love to him as I never felt to anything earthly. Ron Priddis was my friend, and had recruited me to be a writer. Yes! Brents words deepened my own thoughts on God, spiritually and humanity. I need help with casting ZEE5 on my TV. It seems like in the aftermath of the bombings, combined with his zeal to argue the history of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe was excommunicated from The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. No one believed that any one person could do all of those forgeries and build those bombs, and kill those people . Im sure there is a very good possibility that COB personnel would have been more suspect of Jerald, and any information he offered, than Hofmann. Resolved: Release in which this issue/RFE has been resolved. Im glad you found some of my remarks useful and thanks for the kind comments. I just shook my head to hear the tale of the magisterium giving you the boot, Brent. Brent_Metcalfe 7 yr. ago To clarify 4blockhead's list. Does your wife and/or children? She is professor emeritus of history at Read more She related all this to me and my companion. what happens if i ignore a ccj; [4] He grew up a member of the LDS Church in a devout family, and served a mission for the LDS Church. https://egyptianalphabetandgrammar.blogspot.com/. Brent Metcalfe. I appreciate the details of Brents experience. "Everybody that ever dealt with Mark Hofmann was a victim of his, and of his deception, and I think it's just kind of a . Thank you. And how many. But once Mormonism got involved, it turned everything upside down. Once you start to deconstruct Mormonism, the next step is Christianity, and then the existence of a god, or not There are plenty of stops along that road to hang your hat, but the fastest growing belief system around the existence of god, is atheism. The lengthy, five-part series covers Metcalfes childhood in Mormonism, his mission, his time []. What scenario for the books origins have you constructed over your many years of study? According to Metcalfe, he was questioned by LDS Church authorities about his writing for the 7EP and Sunstone was "forced to resign" from his job in April 1983. It is those moments of intimacy that really help me connect to the humanity of the interviewee. Sorry for my language, Im not a native English speaker and there is a limit to what I can express in English. I will start my question with a short story to add some perspective. Is there going to be a part 3? For more information, please see our going back ten+ years when we first interacted online (message boards), but this interview gave me many more insights. Hearing Brent break down the Hoffman timeline and story was amazing. Part 1 of the interview stuck much closer to home for me. I found this podcast to be very fascinating. Great interview. Brent has become one of the foremost scholars in understanding the Book of Abraham. Reply. Brent did Jerald make an official overture to church leadership regarding Hofmann being a fraud? Since you worked for Steven Christensen, could you shed any light on the main reason why Steven purchased documents from Hoffman was it just to donate documents to the church? Great interview. hillside christian church staff/ brent metcalfe excommunicated Create a Word Cloud at Tagxedo.Com. Arent we to try to gain understanding about life and spirituality? It was fascinating and enlightening to see the underbelly of ongoings between church leaders and members. My mind was calm and at peace with God through the Lamb of God, that taketh away the sin of the world. Whatever the reasons, thanks again for your research that revealed there was MTSTWIS (More-To-See-Than-What-I-Saw). OMAHA, Neb. Well also talk in depth with Brent about how he has been able to construct a healthy and happy life outside of Mormonism. Honestly, incredible work. Joseph didnt go like a lamb to the slaughter in burning down personal property he broke the law in a major way. It seems there is some serious self deception that is required to work around these problems that are creating riffs in families, as well as individual conflicts of spiritual dissonance for good members and leaders of the church. I struggled in school with learning how to read for years and this resulted in me developing crippling anxiety any time I was aced to read in public. The message was discovered after his review had gone to press and had to be edited out. I was in a mission conference in Bolivia when Steves younger brother was called out and told of the murder. I remember being troubled by the lack of divine discernment that the brethren have/had. Ive heard there might. Tom, have you considered allowing John to interview you? I suppose the precedent was set by Joseph himself in burning down the Nauvoo Expositor because he didnt like the content, and labelled it anti Mormonit wasnt even, William Law was a believer, who could no longer take Josephs hypocrisy. This book was way above my reading level at the time and I wonder if that may be the biggest hurdle in reaching standard Mormons about the book and its challenges. Good clarification, Doubting Thomas (if that is your real name), :) I have no reason to believe that Jerald Tanner attempted official contact, so Im not sure who Darrick is referring to or what the method of communication entailed. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Im sure this applies to other beliefs as well. Regardless of what one takes to be the truth of things, the evidence is not in favor of liberal religiosity as a recipe for church growth- those churches and communities which move away from their traditional truth claims tend to atrophy relatively speedily. After returning from Iraq after the 2nd deployment as a citizen soldier, I had the same epiphany as Brent; I learned that we are really on our own, there is no God. Growing up as a full believer, Brent followed the conventional routine and did the missions, after which he spent a lot of time in the historical archives of the Church, researching documents and working with the security department. Thank you Brandt for sharing your experiences. Do you have any idea what his views are now about the church, what he did, etc.? Post-Vatican II a renaissance of sorts occurred in scriptural exegesis (for example, scholars no longer felt compelled to affirm the priority of Matthew and they began reassessing the synoptic gospels and John more critically). The interview was superb and the insight into this extraordinary life was gifted. Learn how your comment data is processed. If you hadnt been excommunicated would you still be a member today? Learn how your comment data is processed. In secret, behind closed doors, who were they really betting on? Yet a solid and detailed examination oflhe pre suppositions, methods, arguments, and conclusions of the vari ous readings of the Book of Mormon would still be very use @BHMetcalf. Menu. So glad Brent. Metcalfe is on the editorial board of the John Whitmer Historical Association. The second half was fascinating thank you, thank you, thank you for this podcast! Now that the new Netflix documentary Murder Among the Mormons has come out, it also validates the important witness that Brent was in this event. [] author and editor of numerous articles and two Signature Books titles, was interviewed by John Dehlin for the Mormon Stories podcast recently. But I have a question for Brent. I have to assume hes simply speaking on the basis of snippets of information here and there without context, because this is clearly untrue. In 1994, Professor David Wright of Brandeis University and editor Brent Metcalf were excommunicated for their scripture studies in New Approaches to the Book of Mormon: Explorations in Critical Methodology In 1995, author Janice Allred was excommunicated for her writings about Mother in Heaven. Thats not necessarily a problem, of course. This negative sentiment is perhaps made up for by Hofmann's victims. Steve Christiansen was my bishop in that centerville ward and I grew up with his children. So, based on Krakauers shared experience, it sounds like the answer is no, Hofmann doesnt do interviews. Cookie Notice It didnt have anything to do with church history or anything you would read in something like the CES letter, but was instead a realization and acceptance that its not me, its the church followed by a complete collapse of everything. Brent provided a detailed account of the Mark Hoffman story with a perspective that we seldom hear. I happen to believe so. accounting for llc member buyout; black barber shops chicago; otto ohlendorf descendants; 97 4runner brake bleeding; Freundschaft aufhoren: zu welchem Zeitpunkt sera Semantik Starke & genau so wie parece fair ist und bleibt 7 czerwca 2022. This was an excellent broadcast! I served a mission with the missionary mentioned by Brent. Boy, what a chilling conclusion. I heard he had left the church soon after returning home. Oh, that would be great! An anonymous source reported that Roy Doxey, then the director of church correlation, wanted to know about the papers Metcalfe was studying at the Church Historical Library, which were on Elias Smith and others. As a Mormon History and Rare Document Researcher, Brent Metcalfe has unparalleled knowledge of the religion and its connections in Utah. Funny how I was taught at BYU The Glory of God is Intelligence I find comfort in knowing I am not alone. 2 Introduction at court. Without good research, ours is a heritage shallow in meaning. Why are they so adamant about excommunicating someone who has a different opinion than they do? Thank you John and Brent. One question though, has Hoffman done any interviews since being in prison? In Part 2, Brent describes working for and with Steve Christensen and Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter episode, and the bombings that took the lives of Steve and Kathy Sheets. There is a newish movement who rejects that the book of mormon ever occurred in South America. Rude Dog Never fear! I devoutly attended BYU in the mid 70s. Do as I say and not as I do. This was something I surmised most of my adult life. Do you attend church anyplace else? Brent Lee Metcalfe is an independent researcher and writer of the Latter Day Saint Movement. I may have a chance to look for it next week, but Im not promising anything. Liked by Brent Metcalfe Experience Practice Lead - Mergers and Acquisitions/Investment Group and Consultant Backswath Management Sep 2022 - Present6 months Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Seeking New. [4], In 1993 Metcalfe organized a group of scholars to publish a series of essays that sought to apply techniques of higher criticism to the Book of Mormon. [9][10] His father was the managing director of the Temple Department for the LDS Church. http://mormonstories.org/brent-metcalfe-hofmann-bombings-excommunication-book-of-mormon/, Scan this QR code to download the app now. Metcalfe subsequently resigned from the Seventh East Press and told Sunstone that he would no longer write for them. The gift of your ADHD shines. What are your views about these books and how some contemporary Mormon scholars approach them as catalytic for revelation, though they may not specifically be historical? I was with one of his relatives the day he was charged with the bombings, and she was totally shocked & absolutely certain he had nothing to do with it. Thank you so much for the story and the insights. After years of palling around with anti-Mormon apostates (e.g. Over the years you just reason, that a faith shouldnt be that complicated. https://signaturebookslibrary.org/?p=24440. I thought Brents response to this question very touching and informative and dont see that his research should be discredited. ping anser putter 85068 value; italian village commission. I have some insights into that. Excellent question. October 20, 2021. It would yield some satisfaction to me, if my misery can be a cause of happiness to others; but when I came to the place of prayer, had kneeled down, and closed my eyes, with my hands uplifted toward the heavens, I saw Jesus Christ at the right hand of God looking down upon me, and God the Father looking upon him. Nicely done, John. Brent, a sophomore at the University of Iowa, completed a very hectic. Should have added one more minor thing. Azerbaijan's Jabrayil Hasanov in action against The USA's Brent Metcalf. Hoffman was Laffertys cell mate. Youre one of the few secular critics of the church that can offer a really long perspective on challenges to Mormonisms truth claims. !Cmoninstead, they were duped arranged for major amounts of $ to buy the letter up,bury it and then lie. What did they accomplish by kicking any of you out? Brent is generally a giant in Mormon Studies, and is a great guy. Or at least, Lets Take this Puppy Down.. As someone told him, You didnt have a crisis of faith but a Failure of Faith. Categories . Im definitely a fan. But Brent seems to do just the opposite. Thanks for the clarification, Brent. Definitely one of my top 10 favorite stories on here. Thanks for this podcast! If so, what will be the subject? Quote: More recent studies conducted by Professor of Anthropology Richard B. Stamps, of the Michigan Historical Museum, indicate that the artifacts were made with contemporary tools. But before Brent could truly move on, he had to deal with the emotional turmoil of knowing that he was associated with Mark Hofmann. On the latest episode of Mormon Book Reviews Steven Pynakker interviews one of the most important scholars of Mormonism, Brent Metcalfe. I very much appreciated the beautiful memories and great stories Brent shared about what a remarkable and kind person Steve was. These other people that had experiences dont seem to have a similar backlash evident. Are there still more episodes of this series on the way?? This is one of my all-time favorites. In Episode 497, Brent Metcalfe shares an interesting fact that when Steve Christensen was called to be a Bishop that he told his Stake President that he would never excommunicate a member of his ward and if that was a problem that he wouldnt accept the calling. It also struck me that Brent in some ways represents the inverse of Sandra Tanner. I always enjoyed our discussions years ago about your love for the Indians in your mission and then your experience doing research with their culture and you feelings towards the Book of Mormon. As soon as we can! How did you encourage this masterpiece which, in my opinion, decimates the churchs past claims on the BofA? Anyone know what that is and where I can find out more? It is better thought of by non-Catholics (generally), but this has not translated into conversions or retention of cradle Catholics. "[7] William J. Hamblin responded specifically to an article by Metcalfe. If God will ultimately judge us all, why are mere mortals judging mortals, with the illusion of acting for God? Its probably best to start over when these things happen, rather than just continuing where you left off. All of these documents are available on the Joseph Smith Papers Project website. This doesn't mean that Metcalfe has accurately translated that theory into his study of things Mormon. In it, Metcalfe himself wrote an essay that was the first to advance the Mosiah priority theory, or that Joseph Smith began dictating the Book of Mormon from the Book of Mosiah. Is having spiritual experiences while doing what some may view as critical research on the Book, when you know there may be opposing views to your work, grounds for also having these feelings? In Part 5, we explore the history surrounding Joseph Smith and the Book of Abraham(one of the primary scriptural texts for the LDS Church). Dave, Ive planned on publishing a book for years; but Ive decided to publish a series of articles first that the book will build upon. And I went through a very long phase of just wishing that I had never been born. $95k AVERAGE INCOME Our wealth data indicates income average is $95k. That piqued my interest in the whole sordid affair. The October 1985 bombings that killed two individuals and severely injured another was initially assumed to be related to a financial business. How have things changed over the decades? Get all the information related to Cardinal Health Nps Online - Make website login easier than ever The membership on the website. brent metcalfe excommunicated. Robert Ritner, Egyptologist, wrote a recent book the Joseph Smith Papyri in which he acknowledges your encouragement for that project. See the next John Whitmer Historical Association Journal for one of my essays. Privacy Policy. Thats something each person must decide for themselves, but Ive made peace with my own interpretation.. funeral directors southend; penalty charge notice costs; johns manville headquarters address; Hello world! Thomas, I can assure you Im living on the same planet you are. I havent listened to MS for several years now, but with Brent being interviewed I couldnt miss this, and I wasnt disappointed. Since unit growth of the church is now in decline and growing slower than U.S. and world population growth, how do you see the future of the church and its doctrines? The failure of faith concept was very interesting, and I can only say but for the grace of God. Copyright 2005 - 2023 | Mormon Stories. I had a similar reaction to the section about ADD. They are in a tough spot. and our His contributions, reflections, thoughts and insights represent some of the most important contributions in the history of not just Mormon Stories, but Mormonism in general. It would have helped me a lot to know I was not alone. Certainly the reality, was different than the accepted narrative. I teared up with Brent during that part. Do you still attend LDS church? The Gift of the Mormon Faith Crisis Podcast. Many of the writers did become illustrious personalities, exactly as you point out. Listening now- so far, I like the new intro lots! When will the big book about the Egytian papers be out? On Wiwikipedia, it mentions that in a hit piece done by Dan Peterson, that he encodeds the message, Metcalfe is a butthead. What were your qurarrels like with FARMS? Twitter. I thought your essay in New Approaches was excellent, and certainly complicates traditional understandings of the Book of Mormon; you obviously dont believe the BoM is historical in any way, but Id also guess you would acknowledge the impressive complexity of it. by Brent Metcalfe November 24, 2014 14 Comments Jan Shipps is the perfect inaugural interview for the Mormon Studies podcast. Some people who study and read deeply can be more expert than others with advanced degrees. A man with boldness of speech, and is often cited by members as one of the favourite apostles to hear from. Thank you Brentyou are certainly one of the true Saturdays Warriors Thank you Mormonstories.org I am glad I came across your website! I totally empathize with Brent, and all those who were condemned for their questions and knowledge seeking behavior. The confessionals in the documentary of Hofmann's associates, such as Shannon Flynn, Brent Metcalf and George Throckmorton are captivating. When Brent Metcalfe compiled a book of essays last year suggesting that Mormonism's founding scripture wasn't the ancient history it purports to be, he expected some criticism. Jn John and I are just trying to align our schedules, so expect parts 3 & 4 soon. I just looked down at the paper and I felt this wave of total anxiety come over me and then all of a sudden it was like my brain stopped working and it felt like I was looking at a different language. brent metcalfe excommunicated. When I was on my mission in the early 70s, we were encouraged to show a film called Ancient America Speaks. I love the podcasts. My epiphany also came suddenly, while driving, followed by a massive emotional experience. If the Prophet cant see Hoffman as a fraud, why should anyone assume their Bishop/Stake president has any more ability in terms of divinely inspired discernment? What has been the ramifications to your excommunication among other family members? Don't miss. I would love to hear more about what unfolded after Hoffman, including how you came to be excommunicated, if you care to share that. Coming! Has been quite a while since you had a podcast that wasnt left of center. But Ashment, a fellow member of the church, said he was disgusted with those who publicly protested the church action at a rally for Murphy on Salt Lake City's Main Street plaza Sunday night. As I went towards the house, this thought came into my mind, why do I feel so different from what I did a short time past : I am unspeakably happy and shall never see trouble again.. Really, such a great family. I like Steve Christensens view on excommunication. this was fascinating, and I havent got to part 2 yet! Are you generally satisfied with the way the Mark Hofmann affair has been portrayed in the media and in the various books? The Version table provides details related to the release that this issue/RFE will be addressed. Andrew, Joseph Smith dictated the story of princess Katumin and her regal father Onitas to his scribes Oliver Cowdery and William W. Phelps, who recorded the tale in two small notebooks. Joyce Skabelund October 9, 1938 January 10, 2023 Our mother, grandma, and friend, Joyce Roth Skabelund, 84, departed this life on 10 January 2023. Why do you think it is that the church is so fearful of discoveries such as the letters by Mark H ? Riveting stuff. In episode #276 of The Jimmy Rex Show, we sit down with a key role in Netflix Documentary Murder Among The Mormons, Brent Metcalfe.Visit and Listen to more. And I went through a very long phase of just wishing that I had never been born.. Why didnt the Lord reveal to the prophet that the documents were forged? He remains an enigma. Thanks! Biography [ edit] As a prep wrestler, Metcalf went undefeated with a career record of 228-0, won four consecutive Michigan state titles, and earned six junior national titles. Thanks for the great podcast. Surely, anyone who was even moderately sure of themselves in this case would have responded such as this : We have no idea where this letter came from, theres absolutely no truth in it and we disregard it completely.we maintain Josephs account to be true John and I recorded an additional four hours (till 1 AM). And now, as per reports, Brent Metcalfe has been able to construct a healthy and happy life for himself outside of Mormonism, where he can continue to work as an independent scholar and technical editor without any issues or restrictions. As a teenager and still TBM I read some books on the Hoffman Salamander Letter and events surrounding it. My question to Brent is during or after authoring/editing New Approaches to the Book Mormon, did he have other or similar spiritual experiences that confirmed the historical facts (which may be viewed as counter experiences to those earlier in the church)? Its likely that our paths could have crossed. It was awful so stressful. Metcalfe is on the editorial board of the John Whitmer Historical Association. Hibbard later had a dream in which he again. If you ever get the chance to talk with Steve Christensens wife and/or Brent Metcalfe again, I would like to hear you explore this dichotomy with them as they are polar opposites. If I applied Vatican II to the full breadth of Catholicism, I clearly misspoke (Im not even sure why I would make such a sweeping claim, so I am a tad mystified). Thanks again Brent, no wonder you have had the experience you have shared with your faith about God. I have one teensy-tiny criticism about Johns sensitivity when someone questioned why Brent did not pursue an advanced degree. Yes! Its the same adhominem from his whole establishment that shows how much they think they own the intellectual world. Its very sunny in London today and Ive listened too all eleven hours of this interview. You are hesitant to answer no evil speaking on what you cant say right ;). We were not suppose to discuss the Temple, Blacks and Priesthood, and of course definitely not curtain parts of the church history such as polygamy and polyandry. What has Brent done to mitigate his ADD? I have question on the Book of Abraham. Serious insight and analysis of the religion Im trying to fit into my new, authentic life. What an amazing life Brent! For one thing, you were damn good at martial arts. If you were to interview Mark Hofmann, what would your top questions be? Im glad the church and BYU tried and I dont blame them for making the attempt to shore up the Book of Mormon. [4] Metcalfe assisted Hofmann in leaking the existence of the letter to the press, contrary to the wishes of the LDS Church. I just finished listening to part one and I loved it! We hope to rerecord sometime next week. And it leaves this distrust in LDS leaders hanging with the viewer. Few people had more of a front-row seat than Brent Metcalfe to the goings-on surrounding Mark Hofmann, the Salamander Letter, and the tragic events of October 1985 what would be dubbed as the Mormon Murders.. Perhaps she remembers me, the useless home teacher. I heard this in contrast to the snippet of Steve Christensens wife on a news show asking about what Steve Christensen was threatening Mark Hofmann with if he didnt produce the McClellin collection where she stated something along the lines of He was going to go to the police and have him arrested. On the term translation, JS promoted his ancient texts as translations in the traditional sense. Brent, The view of the Lamb on mount Sion gave me joy unspeakable and full of glory. It shows how establishment Apologists from FAIR and Interpreter and the rest of the former FARMS crew only care about your academic achievements even if you actually do do serious research on the Book of Abraham. I think we ought to be okay with these questions, and not automatically defensive. Brent Metcalf, age 31, Kingsport, TN Lived in: Greeneville TN, Elizabethton TN, Louisville TN Relatives: Terri Treadway, Kathy Edens, Douglas Metcalf View full report Brent E Metcalf, age 39, Semmes, AL Lived in: Wilmer AL, Theodore AL Relatives: Beverly Metcalf, Thomas Metcalf, Thomas Metcalf View full report Fixed: Release in which this issue/RFE has been fixed.The release containing this fix may be available for download as an Early Access Release or a General Availability Release. Mark Metcalfe Project Manager - Heavy Lift Division at Western Mechanical Electrical Millwright Services Ltd. Kitchener, Ontario, Canada 500+ connections From your perspective, what are the 3-5 best pieces of evidence for the historicity of the bom? Afraid that Brent would go public with the contradictory information, the LDS church terminated him as a member. This is definitely a not-miss interview. Brent Lee Metcalfe's Assumptions and Methodologies Reviewed by William 1. In Gnosticism Abraham is not even a real person, the story represents the triumph of spirit over matter and is loaded with hidden symbolic meaning. And theres no way that you can change it. I was only 8 when Steve died, so I just remember his smiling face and that everyone, especially my parents, just loved him. I was hoping you would have spoken more about the Book of Mormon and Abraham. I have been thinking nonstop about that analogy, because it is so illustrative of the disorder. Shortly after returning home and leaving the church he was very active in Sunstone and various things of that nature, but has since moved on with his life and seems very happy with a small family of his own running a small restaurant he and his older brother own together. He has also served in the United States Air Force (Air National Guard) since 2004.